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IceTV IceBox => General => Topic started by: mingus on June 06, 2022, 12:57:23 PM

Title: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: mingus on June 06, 2022, 12:57:23 PM
Hi,
Just looking at replacing an ageing Humax with a new PVR.
Seems the only option currently available for a PVR is a Beyonviz with no hard drive?!
Is there anything else available, maybe I am missing something?
Thanks.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on June 06, 2022, 01:15:02 PM
Hi Mingus,

The current Beyonwiz "V2" uses an external USB hard drive which can be purchased cheaply from Officeworks etc.  They are roughly the size of a small mobile phone and are fairly invisible behind the PVR case.

It is important that the external HDD is reformatted by the V2 in its initial setup.

IceTV is also working on two options:

1) An IceTV "plugin" that will work on any "Enigma2" PVR which is the underlying hardware for the Beyonwiz PVRs so alternatives can be sourced from us.  It will initially be a 2 tuner with internal 1TB HDD, but supply is held up due to the global supply issues until at least August.

2) We are about 4 months away from a BYOB (bring your own box) IceTV app that will give all IceTV functionality to a PC, Raspberry Pi or MiniPC running Linux.  We will supply the app, tuners and remote control.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on June 06, 2022, 04:34:13 PM
Quote from: MD on June 06, 2022, 01:15:02 PM[SNIP]
1) An IceTV "plugin" that will work on any "Enigma2" PVR which is the underlying hardware for the Beyonwiz PVRs so alternatives can be sourced from us.  It will initially be a 2 tuner with internal 1TB HDD, but supply is held up due to the global supply issues until at least August.

2) We are about 4 months away from a BYOB (bring your own box) IceTV app that will give all IceTV functionality to a PC, Raspberry Pi or MiniPC running Linux.  We will supply the app, tuners and remote control.

Supply issues with the V2 probably explains escalation in price; I paid $264.00 for mine in May 2021 and it is now selling for $429.00. I find the V2 more reliable than the T2 (which has a propensity to loose the USB tuner) and supports up to 5 tuners rather than 3.

The bring-you-own (device) sounds interesting - may be time to get my Raspberry Pi out of mothballs.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: mingus on June 06, 2022, 04:58:41 PM
Quote from: MD on June 06, 2022, 01:15:02 PMIceTV is also working on two options:

1) An IceTV "plugin" that will work on any "Enigma2" PVR which is the underlying hardware for the Beyonwiz PVRs so alternatives can be sourced from us.  It will initially be a 2 tuner with internal 1TB HDD, but supply is held up due to the global supply issues until at least August.

2) We are about 4 months away from a BYOB (bring your own box) IceTV app that will give all IceTV functionality to a PC, Raspberry Pi or MiniPC running Linux.  We will supply the app, tuners and remote control.

Ok, thanks for the reply.
These 2 options sound potentially more interesting than the Beyonwiz, especially option 2.
I will sit tight for now and see what develops.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: prl on June 06, 2022, 06:19:01 PM
Quote from: MD on June 06, 2022, 01:15:02 PM1) An IceTV "plugin" that will work on any "Enigma2" PVR which is the underlying hardware for the Beyonwiz PVRs

Enigma2 is the underlying firmware, not hardware.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on June 06, 2022, 06:26:01 PM
Hi prl, yes
I should have been more accurate in my comment saying that it will work on any hardware running Enigma2 firmware as do the T, U and V series Beyonwiz PVRs.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: raymondjpg on June 06, 2022, 06:42:52 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on June 06, 2022, 04:34:13 PMThe bring-you-own (device) sounds interesting - may be time to get my Raspberry Pi out of mothballs.
It will be interesting to me to see what, if any, price IceTV puts on such an app, given that it will already benefit from subscriptions to the IceTV interactive service that it is intended to support.  Also, whether it would only come bundled with the tuners and remote.

I, no doubt like many others, am already in possession of the PC tuners necessary, and have no need for a remote.

Both Emby and Kodi support Enigma2 and NextPVR plugins/addons which enable live TV sufficient for my needs, controlled by a remote that runs the platforms. The only thing missing from these setups is the IceTV Interactive service.

No doubt a business decision for IceTV and for potential subscribers, but as IanL-S says an interesting proposition nonetheless.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on June 06, 2022, 07:26:01 PM
It's a decision made out of necessity as Humax has left the PVR business and Beyonwiz are receding so we decided, maybe a few years too late, to try to become as hardware agnostic as possible. Either via BYOB or possibly easily available and cost competitive "IceTV" miniPCs. Also, to say the expensive Skippa debacle has made me very wary of any specific PVR manufacturer would be an understatement!
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on June 16, 2022, 01:04:45 PM
Quote from: MD on June 06, 2022, 07:26:01 PMIt's a decision made out of necessity as Humax has left the PVR business and Beyonwiz are receding so we decided, maybe a few years too late, to try to become as hardware agnostic as possible. Either via BYOB or possibly easily available and cost competitive "IceTV" miniPCs. Also, to say the expensive Skippa debacle has made me very wary of any specific PVR manufacturer would be an understatement!
Count me in, as someone who would be very interested in buying an "IceTV" miniPC.  One of my 2x Beyonwiz T2s died recently, so I will definitely be in the market for a replacement IceTV box if/when you make them available.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Barista181 on June 26, 2022, 08:39:23 AM
Count me in too ICE. I'm a long time ICE customer and really appreciate the ICE capability so would like to help keep it all going. I'm willing to help with early testing too.

Every few years on average I replace a PVR and I now see my last remaining TRF 2400 is playing up. My T2 and V2 are still going strong and would happily purchase another V2 but not seeing that option available to me the moment so very keen on alternatives that will keep me going with ICE.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on June 26, 2022, 08:53:17 AM
Hi Barista181,  Thanks for your support which is much appreciated.  Last week I placed our first order for just five Intel miniPCs from a company who may be our volume supplier which will be the platform for those who wish to buy hardware instead of putting their own system together.  They will be the first units for beta testing and once we are certain the software is debugged and the UI/UX is very user friendly (a first for PVRs?!) we will place a larger order. If you wish to help testing we'll contact you in about two months to set it up.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Barista181 on June 28, 2022, 12:16:33 PM
Contact when ready. I'm a 'buy hardware' focussed customer that's keen to keep it all going with ICE and will to lay out a certain amount of $ at risk for the potential of a greater good.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on June 28, 2022, 01:00:59 PM
Quote from: Barista181 on June 26, 2022, 08:39:23 AMCount me in too ICE. I'm a long time ICE customer and really appreciate the ICE capability so would like to help keep it all going. I'm willing to help with early testing too.

Every few years on average I replace a PVR and I now see my last remaining TRF 2400 is playing up. My T2 and V2 are still going strong and would happily purchase another V2 but not seeing that option available to me the moment so very keen on alternatives that will keep me going with ICE.

Already being a beta tester, I am also happy to help with beta testing. I have a number of old PCs which I can use, or even via virtual machine on one of my more recent PCs. Even have a few USB tuners that may be compatible.

Please keep us up to date on progress.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on June 28, 2022, 01:10:35 PM
Hi Ian,  yes I have you on the list with Barista and Vader
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: bodogbodog on June 28, 2022, 03:51:56 PM
Happy to help out with testing if you're still looking for volunteers
Plenty of technology hanging around here
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on June 28, 2022, 04:16:46 PM
Hi bodogbodog, you are now on the list.  Many thanks:)
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on July 01, 2022, 09:47:58 AM
Quote from: MD on June 28, 2022, 01:10:35 PMHi Ian,  yes I have you on the list with Barista and Vader
While I am definitely keen to buy one of these units when they become available, I'm not sure I'd make a good "beta tester".  My TV watching habits are a far cry from what most people do...

I very rarely watch "live" TV.  Most of the time I record the programs using my (IceTV enabled) PVR, I then copy the recording across to my desktop PC, where I use "VideoRedo TVSuite" to edit out the ads.  I then watch the edited versions using a media player (NVidia Shield).  My Beyonwiz frequently goes for weeks on end without ever moving out of standby mode.

I'm well aware that this extreme advertisement avoidance strategy is bordering on OCD behaviour, and very few (if any) other people would go to these extremes.

I leave it to your judgement as to whether or not you think I'd be a good beta tester, or just a good customer/consumer.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on July 01, 2022, 10:54:39 AM
Quote from: vader1111 on July 01, 2022, 09:47:58 AM
Quote from: MD on June 28, 2022, 01:10:35 PMHi Ian,  yes I have you on the list with Barista and Vader
........
I leave it to your judgement as to whether or not you think I'd be a good beta tester, or just a good customer/consumer.

I do much the same; however I do use IceTV to schedule the recordings in the first place, which is one important aspect. I tend to watch the edited recordings on my Toppys rather than one of the Beyonwiz (which uses Enigma2); when I watch in a Beyonwiz it is on my U4.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: raymondjpg on July 01, 2022, 02:03:51 PM
Quote from: vader1111 on July 01, 2022, 09:47:58 AMI very rarely watch "live" TV.  Most of the time I record the programs using my (IceTV enabled) PVR, I then copy the recording across to my desktop PC, where I use "VideoRedo TVSuite" to edit out the ads.  I then watch the edited versions using a media player (NVidia Shield).  My Beyonwiz frequently goes for weeks on end without ever moving out of standby mode.
Same here. I don't think you are alone as you think.

An Ice-enabled app for PC would suit your and my requirements to a T!

Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on July 02, 2022, 01:26:34 PM
Quote from: raymondjpg on July 01, 2022, 02:03:51 PM
Quote from: vader1111 on July 01, 2022, 09:47:58 AMI very rarely watch "live" TV.  Most of the time I record the programs using my (IceTV enabled) PVR, I then copy the recording across to my desktop PC, where I use "VideoRedo TVSuite" to edit out the ads.  I then watch the edited versions using a media player (NVidia Shield).  My Beyonwiz frequently goes for weeks on end without ever moving out of standby mode.
Same here. I don't think you are alone as you think.

An Ice-enabled app for PC would suit your and my requirements to a T!


I may not be alone... but I think we are both members of a very small & exclusive club of pathological OCD advertising dodgers.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: NBOSTI on July 02, 2022, 08:58:44 PM
I too am interested in what tuners would be supported.
Same as raymondjpg & vader111, I record, edit (using built in EyeTV capabilities) and save for later viewing. Hours upon hours saved,..when will I get the time?
I currently run two EyeTV  Diversity sticks on an older iMac running Snow Leopard ( the last OS to be able to run the last stable release of EyeTV when still owned by Elgato).
I know Hauppage and Homerun tuners were supported then.
I edit recordings on that  and then move them to a Mac mini (running the same older OS, Snow Leopard) connected to my TV via HDMI.
I can watch recordings via Front Row (older OS feature) using a plug-in (Pye-TV). All with the Apple remote.
Able to delete, fast forward, pause, etc... all that is expected. Not for everyone, but suits me.
I can also watch the recordings using Infuse on my Apple TV. Native support if purchased and up to date.
I have copped a bit of flak in the past about using EyeTV, mainly that my "fetch"  schedule shows that I don't do any. Not going to get into that, I am very happy with it.
The Eye TV sticks came with 2 installation discs (now downloadable for free, as older versions, well the Mac one is), 1 being to run compatible software on Windows.
My question is, what specific tuners will work on this?
A raspberry Pi or similar might be an alternative to the Mini if my sticks are compatible, giving me another OS to have at hand.
Await the beta testing and what the final product will offer.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on July 03, 2022, 12:22:27 PM
We'll be using Hauppage dual USB tuners (there isn't room inside a miniPC for a tuner cards let alone the prohibitive cost of special hardware and enclosure orders). They will have internal 1TB HDDs.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on July 03, 2022, 12:34:39 PM
I had assumed that tuners would be USB only. Will the Enigma2 version you are using support other USB tuners? Out of interest, what "version" of Enigma2 are you using?

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on July 03, 2022, 01:09:45 PM
The E2 boxes are an unknown at the moment as the only supplier I could get to reliably deal the the small volumes we need can't get any supplies themselves. All I know is there was a two tuner PVR at about AU$475 or a four tuner one at AU$650+. Minimal profit to IceTV. Demotivatingly expensive but I have found no others. We would use OpenViX or maybe OpenATV.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: NBOSTI on August 14, 2022, 02:26:03 AM
pardon my ignorance on this. Enigma is new to me.
But what format would the recordings be in?

Just wondering if the hardware will need a HDMI connection, or if it will play back over dlna, or infuse on  Apple TV for that matter. Infuse has handled every file type I have thrown at it so far, including EyeTV. DLNA seems to be file specific for TV systems?
Can I export the recorded files to another os? Convert to another format?
Ignorant? Yes. But curious.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on August 14, 2022, 09:25:27 AM
My understanding is, that for free to air TV transmissions, Enigma2 recording devices merely record the program as broadcast, either in MPEG 2 transport stream, or H.264 transport stream. Program information is in a separate file, *.eit, which (as I understand it) a "standard" way of dealing with program information. DLNA is supported, as are other networking protocols.

I record programs on my Beyonwiz (which uses Enigma2), transfer them to my PC, remove pre and post padding and adds using VideoRedo, use TFtool to convert the *.eit file to *.inf file and create *.nav file so they can be played on my Topfield PVRs like native recordings. With the Beyonwiz, through the support for DLNA, you can watch programs recorded on one Beyonwiz on another Beyonwiz. You can also watch them on PC.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on August 15, 2022, 03:55:11 PM
Any update on when these IceTV enabled mini-PCs might be available?

I'm tossing up the option of sending my dead Beyonwiz T2 away for repair instead, but a new unit is still my preferred option if the price & ETA aren't too bad.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on August 15, 2022, 04:22:00 PM
I'd "guess", as the whole software adaptation is a new world, the ETA of the IceTV miniPC PVR is three months maximum as Dan and I are about three weeks from initial testing of two units, then we'll give out three more for independent customer testing once our own testing establishes stability.  The target price is $449 1 x dual tuner, and approx $145 for an extra dual tuner. but the upward creep of chip prices makes that uncertain.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on August 16, 2022, 01:06:00 PM
Thanks for the update.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on August 20, 2022, 08:21:10 AM
Not sure if this is the appropriate place to mention it, but the beyonwiz website and the Beyonwiz forum have been down since yesterday afternoon.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: grampus on August 20, 2022, 09:00:53 AM
Quote from: IanL-S on August 20, 2022, 08:21:10 AMNot sure if this is the appropriate place to mention it, but the beyonwiz website and the Beyonwiz forum have been down since yesterday afternoon.

Ian
And not sure if it helps or hinders tried ringing, but got an immediate disconnect.
Things certainly not well.

Pity.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: blip on August 20, 2022, 10:00:17 AM
I can see both the Beyonwiz forum and website. I haven't noticed any outages.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on August 20, 2022, 11:09:20 AM
Quote from: blip on August 20, 2022, 10:00:17 AMI can see both the Beyonwiz forum and website. I haven't noticed any outages.

Yes, it they are back now.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: prl on August 20, 2022, 12:16:40 PM

They are back up. See https://forum.icetv.com.au/iceforum/index.php?msg=37510
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: 2353 on August 27, 2022, 04:09:53 PM
Quote from: MD on August 15, 2022, 04:22:00 PMI'd "guess", as the whole software adaptation is a new world, the ETA of the IceTV miniPC PVR is three months maximum as Dan and I are about three weeks from initial testing of two units, then we'll give out three more for independent customer testing once our own testing establishes stability.  The target price is $449 1 x dual tuner, and approx $145 for an extra dual tuner. but the upward creep of chip prices makes that uncertain.

Hi MD,

Just wondering how the testing of your solution to not being able to get a IceTV compatible PVR is going. The reason for asking is that I currently have a Beyonwiz T3 that occasionally gives a hint it is not long for this world and I'd hate to lose IceTV capability. No pressure!
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on August 27, 2022, 04:34:35 PM
On our bi-weekly IcePicks email we recommend Nasa Electronics who do excellent and reasonably priced repairs to Beyonwiz PVRs.  It may be a cheap stop gap until our own PVR comes out in a few months and may well add a couple of years onto your Beyonwiz.  Here's the address though the email has a click through on the email page.  https://www.nasaelectronics.com.au

Our software development is no lightweight task but we are now running it on the miniPC that we intend to use as the PVR. We will commence using and debugging it in a week or so.  I'd estimate it will go live in about two months but that is hostage to chip supplies and delivery of the hardware to Australia.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: bodogbodog on August 27, 2022, 04:37:22 PM
Quote from: MD on August 27, 2022, 04:34:35 PMOn our bi-weekly IcePicks email we recommend Nasa Electronics who do excellent and reasonably priced repairs to Beyonwiz PVRs. 

Also worth noting they listed and sold three V2's (described as seller refurbished with 45 day warranty) @ $249 each - diskless, dual tuner with wifi adapter and remote this week on eBay (I know as I bought one as a spare) - so pays to setup a search on eBay if you're looking for a V2 as they may have more to sell

Update - they seem to be listing them regularly - here's on posted on 30/8 - https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/115509365504?
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on August 27, 2022, 06:03:48 PM
Quote from: MD on August 27, 2022, 04:34:35 PMOur software development is no lightweight task but we are now running it on the miniPC that we intend to use as the PVR.

Thanks for the update.

To get it running at all is a major step forward. I am not aware of anyone getting that far in recent times. Someone started development on a PC based Enigma2 device around 2016 but the project died in early beta stage - the project page not updated since 2016.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: 2353 on September 05, 2022, 06:16:24 PM
Quote from: MD on August 27, 2022, 04:34:35 PMWe will commence using and debugging it in a week or so.  I'd estimate it will go live in about two months but that is hostage to chip supplies and delivery of the hardware to Australia.
Thanks and good luck!
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Andrew Smith on September 09, 2022, 08:52:42 PM
Gosh I should come by here more often.  :-)

Available to help with testing if I should be of use to you.  I've previously been a beta tester for a few versions of Corel Draw and also some other comparatively minor software titles.  I know how to do a bug report.

Glad to see you are creating a way forward for when current equipment completes its life span.

Andrew
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on September 09, 2022, 09:45:26 PM
Hi Andrew, thanks for your support and you are on the list of beta testers.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Gary on October 20, 2022, 05:34:14 PM
Just wanted to offer my services as one of the beta testers if you would like another.

A very long term user and moderator on the Beyonwiz forum.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: kazz on October 22, 2022, 05:51:01 PM
I'm happy to hear you guys are working on an ICETV box I have 2 x BW V2's but one is playing up and I'm old school I need my PVR's.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on October 23, 2022, 10:36:13 AM
MD, I would appreciate an update on progress with this project.

Many thanks,

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on October 23, 2022, 11:04:48 AM
Box and RCU being developed and tested by Dan atm. Second box being sent to me tomorrow. New website store page with all "IceBox" details and "Register Your Interest" going up next Friday. First batch of 100 being ordered by next Friday. They go live for sale on December 1 giving us November to finish UI/UX and debug on the existing five units.

Best known plans of mice and men...
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on October 23, 2022, 01:19:24 PM
Thanks for the update MD. Much appreciated.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on October 28, 2022, 01:29:12 PM
MD I see that the www site now has details on the new IceBox.

Any idea when the bring your one device firmware will be available; I have a spare NUC style PC I would like to test it on.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: DeltaMikeCharlie on October 28, 2022, 05:53:14 PM
I just read the IceBox page and I have some questions/observations:

1) I assume that programs to record can be set via the Ice TV web site, however, what additional network access capabilities does it have? (HTTP, FTP, NFS, SMB, DLNA, etc)
2) How frequently does the IceBox update its EPG and programs to be recorded?
3) Can it run plug-ins? (I have Topfields and use lots of TAPs)
4) If you already have an ICE TV subscription, does the free 90 days that comes with the IceBox get credited to your existing subscription?
5) The remote control unit seems sparse.  No numerals, red/green/yellow/blue functions keys.  Can remote control features be added/customised? (See plug-ins above).
6) Can a USB keyboard/mouse be connected and used with the UI?
7) Does the remote use both IR and RF?
8) Can the remote functions be integrated into a universal remote?
9) Can you choose/blend between the FTA EPG and the ICE EPG sources?
10) Are consecutive programs recorded into a single file or individual files?
11) If individual file and based on EPG timing, is padding/overlap provided on each file so that you don't have to play the start of the second recording to see the end of the first program?
12) If single file, can the user easily navigate between the programs within said single recording?
13) Does the IceBox support Wake-On-Lan (or similar) so that it can be woken up remotely?
14) Can the user increase the storage and/or add external storage that can be recorded to directly?
15) Can recordings be sent to a NAS, etc?
16) What is the core firmware?  (Linux + Kodi/similar or proprietary)
17) Does it support streaming services?  (Netflix, Amazon, Stan, YouTube, etc)
18) How is the storage split between the TF Card and SSD?  (OS / Recordings?)
19) What playback/navigation features are available?
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on October 29, 2022, 09:09:45 AM
DMC, the most recent information I have is that it will use Enigma2, and I suspect it will be running on Linux variant. I have not yet got my hands on a unit, but no doubt will get one for final stage beta testing, so everything I say below is based to my research on Enigma2 and experience with Beyowiz that use Enigma2.

I suspect that a vanilla Enigma2 base is being used, so there should be support for most of the network protocols you mention (the Beyonwiz with its aging Enigma2 base code supports all those you mention).

My understanding is that OpenwbIF is also a standard feature of Enigma2, which while not as powerful in some ways as WebControl, allows a significant level of remote control.

The IceTV Enigma2 plugin on the Beyonwiz gives users control over how frequently EPG and timer data is downloaded; the most frequent is every 15 minutes. I assume that the IceTV implementation for the IceBox will be similar if it uses the same API.

Enigma2 supports plugins; not sure how extensive they are. I am not aware of any plugins for streaming services.

Enigma2 scheduling does not (normally) result in pre- and post-padding being ignored (particularly when there a one or more consecutive recordings on the same LCN). There is probably some management algarythim when the number of "concurrent" timers is large, and multiple networks are used. Unfortunately, pre- and post-padding are global settings. Not sure how many concurrent recordings are possible.

Enigma2 supports keyboards; I have used USB keyboard with my T2, U4 and V2. Support for wireless keyboards is patchy - my Logitech 4000 works with U4 and V2 (including the touchpad) but no longer works with the T2.

Enigma2 also supports recording to external devices, such as USB drives, NAS and I think other network shares.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on October 29, 2022, 10:31:16 AM
Quote from: IanL-S on October 29, 2022, 09:09:45 AMDMC, the most recent information I have is that it will use Enigma2, and I suspect it will be running on Linux variant. I have not yet got my hands on a unit, but no doubt will get one for final stage beta testing, so everything I say below is based to my research on Enigma2 and experience with Beyowiz that use Enigma2.

Ian


I thought I should elaborate on this comment. The most likely host OS is Linux, as it is, because it is open source freely distributable - necessary when you are offering IceBox image free to those with their own (suitable) hardware.

Android TV is not open source so would not be viable, although there is the Android Open Source Project but that would I suspect much more difficult to base the IceBox on than Linux, particularly if Enigma2 is being used. I am not aware of a viable alternative to Enigma2. For the same reason, Windows would not be considered.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on October 29, 2022, 10:43:56 AM
1) I assume that programs to record can be set via the Ice TV web site, however, what additional network access capabilities does it have? (HTTP, FTP, NFS, SMB, DLNA, etc)
A) Yes of course, and in terms of network, really most of them are available
2) How frequently does the IceBox update its EPG and programs to be recorded?
A) At the moment like most it's 15 minutes, but this could change
3) Can it run plug-ins? (I have Topfields and use lots of TAPs)
A) Yes, many
4) If you already have an ICE TV subscription, does the free 90 days that comes with the IceBox get credited to your existing subscription?
A) Yes (as we always do)
5) The remote control unit seems sparse.  No numerals, red/green/yellow/blue functions keys.  Can remote control features be added/customised? (See plug-ins above).
A) Yes. The remote is designed to be simple to enable easy playback of recordings and easy pause without looking at it in the dark. You can probably use most remote controls, keyboard and mouse and using the TV remote via HDMI-CEC.
6) Can a USB keyboard/mouse be connected and used with the UI?
A) See above
7) Does the remote use both IR and RF?
A)  No, just RF so the box can be hidden if preferred
8) Can the remote functions be integrated into a universal remote?
A) The unit itself doesn't have an IR receiver built in, but it has a lot of options so maybe yes via an added IR receiver
9) Can you choose/blend between the FTA EPG and the ICE EPG sources?
A) This is possible but not within the same user setup.  One or the other.
10) Are consecutive programs recorded into a single file or individual files?
A) Individual files
11) If individual file and based on EPG timing, is padding/overlap provided on each file so that you don't have to play the start of the second recording to see the end of the first program?
A) Padding/overlap is provided on each file
12) If single file, can the user easily navigate between the programs within said single recording?
A) Yes
13) Does the IceBox support Wake-On-Lan (or similar) so that it can be woken up remotely?
A) Yes
14) Can the user increase the storage and/or add external storage that can be recorded to directly?
A) Yes but up to the user to configure
15) Can recordings be sent to a NAS, etc?
A) Not yet tested but probably and up to the user to configure
16) What is the core firmware?  (Linux + Kodi/similar or proprietary)
A) LibreElec based
17) Does it support streaming services?  (Netflix, Amazon, Stan, YouTube, etc)
A) There are some unauthorised plugins out there but not officially supported.
18) How is the storage split between the TF Card and SSD?  (OS / Recordings?)
A) OS is small, only around 200MB or so, the rest is storage
19) What playback/navigation features are available?
A) Heaps!

I hope that helps:)
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: DeltaMikeCharlie on October 29, 2022, 03:28:26 PM
Quote from: MD on October 29, 2022, 10:43:56 AMI hope that helps:)

Thanks MD.

LibreELEC basically seems to be an Ubuntu-based minimal Linux distribution (presumably with device drivers for DVB tuners, RCU, etc) that comes with Kodi pre-installed.

Have you added ICE functionality purely via a Kodi Add-on/Skin or have you also modified Linux and/or Kodi directly?

I downloaded the OVA version (v10.0.2) of LibreELEC and tried it out with VirtualBox.

I was able to get the Web interface working, however, lacking tuners etc in the VM meant that the experience was somewhat lacking.

I also managed to setup an NFS mount to one of my Topfield PVRs and commence playback of a recording.  Playback stuttered and eventually stalled.  However, I am assuming that this too was to do with VM resourcing and lack of GPU, etc.

UPnP to a Fetch PVR had the same results as the Topfield.

I could browse the LibreELEC PVR from a Windows PC, but there was no media available, obviously.

Looks interesting.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on October 29, 2022, 05:41:00 PM
DMC

Thanks for this information. Had not considered using a VM; will try it out later.

Looking at the documentation it seems that there is extensive support for RCUs, and it is possilbe to roll-you-own configuation for ones that are not supported. Not clear which USB tuners are supported.

There is an Enigma2 plugin for Kodi; not sure if the IceBox will use it to implement the PVR functions.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: DeltaMikeCharlie on October 29, 2022, 06:49:33 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on October 29, 2022, 05:41:00 PMHad not considered using a VM; will try it out later.

In VirtualBox, I had to increase the video RAM and enable 3D to get it to boot.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: raymondjpg on October 30, 2022, 09:12:28 AM
Quote from: DeltaMikeCharlie on October 29, 2022, 06:49:33 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on October 29, 2022, 05:41:00 PMHad not considered using a VM; will try it out later.

In VirtualBox, I had to increase the video RAM and enable 3D to get it to boot.
VMware Workstation 16 Player probably also worth a try.

Edit: OVA version (v10.0.2) of LibreELEC imported into VMware Workstation 16 Player, configured with NextPVR addon TV backend, picked up host windows 11 installation of NextPVR and recorded a program without any stuttering. Only hitch is VMware installation of LibreELEC hogs mouse input (once initiated) and will not release it, necessitating power down of the VM to restore mouse functionality to host. Ctrl-Alt restores mouse functionality to host.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on October 31, 2022, 03:27:03 PM
Many of my questions have already been answered, thanks to DMC's lengthy checklist.  It looks like most (if not all) of the behaviours will be similar to those of my existing Beyonwiz devices (both being Enigma2).

I note that pre- and post-padding can be added.  Is this user configurable?

Similarly, you've said that box has a "skip function", for jumping across ads.  Is this user programmable?  How many jump settings?  For example, my Beyonwiz has 4x jump settings (for the up, down, left, right buttons), set to -60, -10, +30, and +180 seconds.

One of the few annoying features of my Beyonwiz T2s, is a problem I encounter when viewing recordings in "chase play" mode - starting the program after the scheduled start time, then skipping through the ads, until I am close to "live".  The problem is that "skipping" to within 3-5 minutes of the end results in playback skipping straight to "live", missing those 3-5 minutes of programming.  Does the IceBox have a similar fault, given that it's another Enigma2 machine?

The Beyonwiz devices are able to mount each other as network drives, and I can stop playback on one device, picking up where I left off on the other device (e.g. I can watch the second half in bed, having watched the first half in the lounge room).  Given that both Beyonwiz and IceBox will use Enigma2, will they have this level of compatibility?

Possibly the most important question... will the IceBox come with a comprehensive user manual (unlike Beyonwiz devices)?
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on October 31, 2022, 05:11:35 PM
Hi Vader1111

See item 16 of DMC list:
16) What is the core firmware?  (Linux + Kodi/similar or proprietary)
A) LibreElec based

Pre and Post Padding can be configured.

As such its skipping is somewhat different in that repeated presses of the right button give increments of 10, 30, 60, 120 and so on; the left arrow does the reverse.  These can be configured. Currently the up and down arrows do 10% jumps. We can override these but there is only so much time in the day so they will come later depending on the majority of customer preferences.

Chase play starts when paused but can be configured to keep a previously set "buffer".

The jumping out of chase play should not occur during 3-5 minutes before the the end though once one gets to a few seconds I'm sure it will.

What we ask all forum "Gurus" to remember is that initially we have to bring out a PVR that completely satisfies the user needs for the average PVR user, who are the majority of IceTV users, a typical person who records his TV shows on a stand alone box.  The more technical add-ons will come as we tweak the various functions wrt what the majority of customers want.  Much of the UX can be re-configured by the user with some research.

.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on October 31, 2022, 05:52:58 PM
Quote from: MD on October 31, 2022, 05:11:35 PM<<< SNIP >>>
What we ask all forum "Gurus" to remember is that initially we have to bring out a PVR that completely satisfies the user needs for the average PVR user, who are the majority of IceTV users, a typical person who records his TV shows on a stand alone box.  The more technical add-ons will come as we tweak the various functions wrt what the majority of customers want.  Much of the UX can be re-configured by the user with some research.


I for one fully understand this. While, for example, Enigma2 implementations can do all sorts of interesting things, at this stage it is appropriate to concentrate on getting a box that everyday users can use without having to get into complexities of system configuration. As MD says, those who want to reconfigure the UX should be able to find out how to do so with a little research.

Ian

Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on November 01, 2022, 11:53:55 AM
Quote from: MD on October 31, 2022, 05:11:35 PMHi Vader1111

See item 16 of DMC list:
16) What is the core firmware?  (Linux + Kodi/similar or proprietary)
A) LibreElec based

Pre and Post Padding can be configured.

As such its skipping is somewhat different in that repeated presses of the right button give increments of 10, 30, 60, 120 and so on; the left arrow does the reverse.  These can be configured. Currently the up and down arrows do 10% jumps. We can override these but there is only so much time in the day so they will come later depending on the majority of customer preferences.

Chase play starts when paused but can be configured to keep a previously set "buffer".

The jumping out of chase play should not occur during 3-5 minutes before the the end though once one gets to a few seconds I'm sure it will.

What we ask all forum "Gurus" to remember is that initially we have to bring out a PVR that completely satisfies the user needs for the average PVR user, who are the majority of IceTV users, a typical person who records his TV shows on a stand alone box.  The more technical add-ons will come as we tweak the various functions wrt what the majority of customers want.  Much of the UX can be re-configured by the user with some research.

.
Thanks for getting back to me, MD.

I have no idea what LibreElec is/isn't capable of, all I know is what I have previously experienced with Beyonwiz, which is another Enigma2 system.  Thank you for explaining it to me.

I am quite happy to be receiving a "basic functionality" box, with additional functionality coming in subsequent updates.  I appreciate that development of the IceBox has been compressed, due to all of the other IceTV enabled PVR companies going out of business.  I really enjoy the functionality of both IceTV and my PVRs, and am extremely happy that you have come up with a way of keeping the ecosystem alive.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 01, 2022, 12:18:44 PM
This post was made when I was under the misapprehension that the IceBox used Enigma2.

vader1111

Considering resuming paying recording on the IceBox that you have been playing on a Beyonwiz (or the other way around), since Enigma2 devices use a the same recording format, resuming playing should work. The recording is in the *.ts file (MEPEG2 program stream or H.264 program stream), the EPG data is in the *.eit file, and the *ap, *ts.cuts, *.meta and *.sc. The *.ts.cuts
stores the last position where the recording was stopped while playing - so if that file is present things should be OK.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on November 01, 2022, 12:33:15 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on November 01, 2022, 12:18:44 PMvader1111

Considering resuming paying recording on the IceBox that you have been playing on a Beyonwiz (or the other way around), since Enigma2 devices use a the same recording format, resuming playing should work. The recording is in the *.ts file (MEPEG2 program stream or H.264 program stream), the EPG data is in the *.eit file, and the *ap, *ts.cuts, *.meta and *.sc. The *.ts.cuts
stores the last position where the recording was stopped while playing - so if that file is present things should be OK.

Ian
 
Awesome!  I hoped this would be the case, when I read that the IceBox would be Enigma2 (the same as Beyonwiz).
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 01, 2022, 12:39:21 PM
For those of you who wish to find out more I suggest looking at the wiki:
https://wiki.libreelec.tv/
and the Forum:
https://forum.libreelec.tv/

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: DeltaMikeCharlie on November 02, 2022, 04:35:29 PM
I have another set of questions, this time concentrating on the user experience.

I am not the primary PVR user in our household, merely the primary technical support resource.

We have Topfield and Fetch PVRs and the thing that they have in common is that when they start, they default directly into live TV.  This is normally on the service that was being viewed as the unit was powered-off, but can also be the last recorded channel if all tuners needed to be used for recordings.

Q1: What will the default power-on state of the IceBox be?
Q2: If it is not live TV, what is the default power-on state?

With both Topfield and Fetch, I can get to the EPG with one key press.
Q3: How many key presses will be required to display the EPG?
Q4: Will users be able to set single/series recordings from the EPG screen?
Q5: Will EPG keyword searches be possible?
Q6: If so, will the matching be performed locally on the PVR or remotely on the Fetch server?

To access TV recordings (excluding scrolling), Topfield requires a single key press, whereas Fetch requires four.
Q7: How many key presses will be required at access recorded TV from watching live TV?

To view a list of scheduled recordings, Topfield needs two key presses by default but an add-in can reduce that to one, Fetch needs five.
Q8: How many key presses are required to view a list of upcoming recordings?

Q9: When watching live TV and/or time-shifting, and the user decides to record that programme, is the existing time-shift buffer prepended to the recording (or otherwise saved) or does the recording begin at the current point?
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 02, 2022, 05:36:46 PM
DMC

At this stage I suspect that the most comprehensive way to control the IceBox whould be using table or phone (or a PC). OpenWebif is used for remote access to Enigma2 operatings. It can also be used to access LibreELEC itself.

For LibreELEC, one of the setup parameters is the mode in which the deviced boots to; for the IceBox that would be to the Enigma2 plug. I suspect that the Enigma2 default would be to live TV.

LibreELEC claims to have wide RCU support, so we do not have to rely on the RCU that comes with the IceBox. There is listing of basic commands that are supported on the wiki [https://wiki.libreelec.tv/configuration/ir-remotes]. When I "role my own" IceBox I will see if I can get various Toppy and Beyonwiz RCU to work [afterthought: and the Skippa RCU]; they all have dedicated keys for EPG, Timer List, and Recordings list. Hopefully they can be used without having to resort to customise settings.

I hope to be able to give a listing of "common" remotes that work with the IceBox before the end of beta testing.

My recollection is that there are problems with Beyonwiz if you are watching either live TV or using the buffer, then going into record mode. But the Beyonwiz used an Enigma2 implementation that is several gerneation old.

Hopefully it will be possible to set IceTV series recordings from the IceBox; if not there is way of doing so with Enigma2 EPG implemenation - I suspect it is a sub-set of Autotimer function.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on November 02, 2022, 08:06:40 PM
For recordings there is a button with an IceTV logo that takes one straight to the list.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 03, 2022, 02:31:27 PM
Greetings IceTV enthusiasts! What follow is the IanL-S understanding of the current status of the project; the responsibility for the content is mine alone.

I gather that MD is gratified by the interest shown in this thread.

Over time things have become a little confused about the steps being taken by IceTV in response to the demise of Beyonwiz. There is a two-pronged approach:




Understandably the primary focus in on getting the IceBox PVR functions working smoothly. Many of the things that we enthusiasts are interested in may not fit in with the priorities that that have been decided on for progressing the IceBox PVR. The important thing is the creation of a PVR that ordinary users will find both easy and intuitive to use.

How does the IceBox PVR Work? My understanding is that IceTV has high expectations for the IceBox PVR. It is to be everything the Skippa was intended to be and more. Presumably it will forsake everything that was bad about the Skippa (the responsibility of the OEM) and retain everything that was good about the Skippa. Good would include the ability to set series recording using the IceBox. The bad would include using numbers to name recoding that were then assoicated with program name (and details) via an (unreliable) internal data base.

OpenWebif: While LibreELEC comes with an implementation of OpenWebif, the IceBox PVR functions are not designed to be accessed by OpenWebif (and I'm not sure what one would want to do that cannot be done by IceTV app or IceTV www site).

Playing media on other network devices: The networking protocols that LibreELEC supports should allow users to access content on network connected devices that use one of the protocols. I assume that such media will be "played" using Kodi itself, rather than IceBox PVR. As far as I can work out LibreELEC Kodi implementation does not have native player for Enigma2 recordings such as those created by a Beyonwiz; they will be played as standard MEPEG2 ts or H.264 ts recordings.

User support: IceTV will provide information to assist users in setting up the IceBox and its day-to day use. MD has accepted my offer to set up a wiki through which "user initiated" development of "more exotic usage" can be progressed and documented.

Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: raymondjpg on November 03, 2022, 04:24:30 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on November 03, 2022, 02:31:27 PMOpenWebif: While LibreELEC comes with an implementation of OpenWebif, the IceBox PVR functions are not designed to be accessed by OpenWebif (and I'm not sure what one would want to do that cannot be done by IceTV app or IceTV www site).
One would want to do this for the same reason that OpenWebif is implemented for BW PVRs - to allow for headless management of options, timers and recordings.

The only implementation of web access I can find in LibreELEC is Chorus2. There is no sign of an OpenWebif addon, either in the repositories available in LibreELEC, or come to that in Windows implementations of Kodi. My reading of Chorus2 is that it is oriented towards media management, and I was unable to find or configure any other of my LibreELEC service or PVR addons through the interface.

This is not a complaint but an observation. All may be configurable through the IceTV app. If I had a complaint it would be that the standard response to the inability to copy and paste text to linux versions of Kodi goes something along the lines that it is not needed because it is a media application. Looks like typical linux hubris to me, and I had hoped that some web access would be able to get around it.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 03, 2022, 04:32:55 PM
I am sure I came across a reference to OpenWebif when reading up on LibreELEC; but as always it is possible that I am mistaken. A bit disappointing if it is not available. I am certain that it was not in relation to the (unstable) Enigma2 plugin.

Well did another quick search and could find nothing - clearly a seniors moment! Have updated the post.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: prl on November 03, 2022, 04:55:50 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on November 03, 2022, 02:31:27 PMBeyonwiz OS is a fork of OpenViX

No, it was based on a different Enigma2 variant, but I can't remember which one. Peteru posted the genealogy of the Beyonwiz firmware on the Beyonwiz forum, but it's no longer available.

And it's not technically a fork, in Git parlance.

But of OpenViX and OpenATV, I prefer the OpenViX UX, which is a bit closer to the Beyonwiz in that respect.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: prl on November 03, 2022, 05:03:37 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on November 03, 2022, 02:31:27 PMThe development of IceTV plugin that will work with European Enigma2 boxes. It is my understanding that initially it will be available for OpenViX

There is already a port of the IceTV plugin in OpenATV. It had become inoperable over time, but I recently fixed its worst problems (one of which was that the IceTV plugin would go into an infinite loop when it tried to download the EPG and timers) and those fixes are now in the current release of OpenATV.

There is now a standalone IceTV plugin that I have ported to OpenViX. It still has some minor problems that I'm working on, and I don't know whether it has filtered through to an OpenViX release (rather than a developer version). I don't think that it's quite ready for showtime.

But I have also looked at making it portable to OpenATV, and I've done most of the work needed for that, and discussed it with the OpenATV developers, but I won't try to get the current OpenATV version replaced by the new version until I've ironed out the other issues.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 03, 2022, 06:31:17 PM
Peter, thanks for the update on IceTV Enigma2 plugins.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: johnmw1 on November 04, 2022, 08:53:27 AM
As an original owner of a DP-S1 which is just starting to give me some grief, I look forward to being able to finally replace it very soon. I would be keen to learn more about BYOB also.

Cheers,
John
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on November 04, 2022, 09:57:07 AM
Hi John,

The BYOB store page will go live within the next week which should help.  For the time being go to the IceBox store page and simply imagine installing the software to repurpose an old PC you may have. Shortly that software will also work on Raspberry Pi, Mac Minis etc too.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: johnmw1 on November 04, 2022, 10:16:42 AM
Hi Colin,

Thanks for the update, I look forward to it.

Cheers,
John
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on November 04, 2022, 11:14:32 AM
Hi again John,

The IceTV website BYOB store page is now live.  Note the software download, when available, will initially only work on a PC.  Raspberry Pi etc will need some more work at our end and will come later, as soon as we can.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: johnmw1 on November 04, 2022, 11:21:03 AM
Great, I shall go and study it right now. :-)

Cheers,
John
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on November 04, 2022, 02:26:43 PM
Looking at the photos on the IceBox web page, the USB 3 ports seem to be fairly close together - and the USB Dual Tuners appears to be fairly large.

Is it physically possible to plug 2x tuners into the USB 3 ports on the side of the box? Or, will we need to plug one into a USB 3 port on the side, and the other in a USB 2 port on the rear?
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: DeltaMikeCharlie on November 04, 2022, 02:47:26 PM
Quote from: MD on October 29, 2022, 10:43:56 AM5) The remote control unit seems sparse.  No numerals, red/green/yellow/blue functions keys.  Can remote control features be added/customised? (See plug-ins above).
A) Yes. The remote is designed to be simple to enable easy playback of recordings and easy pause without looking at it in the dark. You can probably use most remote controls, keyboard and mouse and using the TV remote via HDMI-CEC.
6) Can a USB keyboard/mouse be connected and used with the UI?
A) See above
7) Does the remote use both IR and RF?
A)  No, just RF so the box can be hidden if preferred
8) Can the remote functions be integrated into a universal remote?
A) The unit itself doesn't have an IR receiver built in, but it has a lot of options so maybe yes via an added IR receiver

I dug a little deeper into the remote control:

The remote control pictured in the IceBox web page seems to be a customised G20S Air Mouse (or similar).  It seems to use 2.4Ghz connectivity.  Angling the RCU up and down and from side to side seems to control the mouse cursor on the screen.

I'm guessing that it is supplied with a small USB dongle, however, this is not pictured on the IceTV web site.

These devices appear to present as a standard USB HID device and will be seen by the host as a keyboard/mouse.

The Kodi web site has a page regarding RF remote controls.

https://kodi.wiki/view/RF_remote_controls (https://kodi.wiki/view/RF_remote_controls)

As well as a page on how to customise Kodi for other RF remote controls.

https://kodi.wiki/view/Keymap (https://kodi.wiki/view/Keymap)

There is also a Kodi add-on to help with configuring remote controls.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on November 04, 2022, 02:57:08 PM
Hi Vader1111,

Yes the USB ports on the IceBox are too close to plug the tuners in side by side. However they come with USB male to female extension cables about 20cm long and the do plug inside by side into the splitter we sell, which is how I have them set up on my test box.

DCM - there is a tiny USB wifi dongle supplied which I have plugged into a side USB port.

The gyroscopic control is disabled as it's of no use for the UI.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: johnmw1 on November 04, 2022, 03:08:44 PM
I wonder if the Playstation tuner I purchased in anticipation of one day owning a V2 will now work on the new BYOB setup?

Cheers,
John
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: vader1111 on November 04, 2022, 03:43:18 PM
Quote from: MD on November 04, 2022, 02:57:08 PMHi Vader1111,

Yes the USB ports on the IceBox are too close to plug the tuners in side by side. However they come with USB male to female extension cables about 20cm long and the do plug inside by side into the splitter we sell, which is how I have them set up on my test box.

DCM - there is a tiny USB wifi dongle supplied which I have plugged into a side USB port.

The gyroscopic control is disabled as it's of no use for the UI.
Excellent.  I was looking at the splitter, and wondering if they'd fit side-by side there.

Using USB extension cables (USB 3) would be an excellent solution to the problem.

So... with 2x USB tuners, and a WiFi dongle for the air mouse, that's 3x USB ports accounted for.  Just as well it comes with 4!
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 04, 2022, 04:38:35 PM
I suspect the tuners can be attached to an unpowered USB hub (they do not use much power); I have done this with my Beyonwiz U4.

The 1T MSATA drive should be sufficient for most users. The only drawback to MSATA is that they can be diffuclt to find, particularly in larger capacities. Fortunately, it also suporst 2.5" SATA drive. For a PVR a HDD is adequate (although SSD will be noiseless).

The NUC styple miniPC that I am going to use for a build-you-own IceBox has an NVMe M.2 solt in which I have a cheap 1 TB NVMe drive (had to go with NVME as no SATA port). Since most NUC styple PCs only suport PCIe 2, there is no point in getting a performance drive.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 04, 2022, 04:42:41 PM
Quote from: johnmw1 on November 04, 2022, 03:08:44 PMI wonder if the Playstation tuner I purchased in anticipation of one day owning a V2 will now work on the new BYOB setup?

Cheers,
John

I am wondering the same; I have a spare PlayTV tuner.

MD has indicated that Beta Testing Team will get units to test before publice release, so I will test and report back! I have a few other USB turners that I will also test.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: raymondjpg on November 05, 2022, 03:39:06 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on November 04, 2022, 04:42:41 PM
Quote from: johnmw1 on November 04, 2022, 03:08:44 PMI wonder if the Playstation tuner I purchased in anticipation of one day owning a V2 will now work on the new BYOB setup?

Cheers,
John

I am wondering the same; I have a spare PlayTV tuner.

MD has indicated that Beta Testing Team will get units to test before publice release, so I will test and report back! I have a few other USB turners that I will also test.

Ian

According to this https://forum.libreelec.tv/thread/10713-librelec-generic-8-2-1-tvheadend-and-sony-playtv-tuner/ it should, although how well may depend on power supply.

I know that the Hauppauge WinTV-dualHD works with the LibreELEC Tvheadend addon, but again in a desktop PC VM so power supply may not be so much of an issue.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: johnmw1 on November 05, 2022, 04:18:59 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on November 04, 2022, 04:42:41 PM
Quote from: johnmw1 on November 04, 2022, 03:08:44 PMI wonder if the Playstation tuner I purchased in anticipation of one day owning a V2 will now work on the new BYOB setup?

Cheers,
John

I am wondering the same; I have a spare PlayTV tuner.

MD has indicated that Beta Testing Team will get units to test before public release, so I will test and report back! I have a few other USB turners that I will also test.

Ian

Thanks Ian, I look forward to the results.

Cheers,
John
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: johnmw1 on November 05, 2022, 04:24:09 PM
Quote from: raymondjpg on November 05, 2022, 03:39:06 PM
Quote from: IanL-S on November 04, 2022, 04:42:41 PM
Quote from: johnmw1 on November 04, 2022, 03:08:44 PMI wonder if the Playstation tuner I purchased in anticipation of one day owning a V2 will now work on the new BYOB setup?

Cheers,
John

I am wondering the same; I have a spare PlayTV tuner.

MD has indicated that Beta Testing Team will get units to test before publice release, so I will test and report back! I have a few other USB turners that I will also test.

Ian

According to this https://forum.libreelec.tv/thread/10713-librelec-generic-8-2-1-tvheadend-and-sony-playtv-tuner/ it should, although how well may depend on power supply.

I know that the Hauppauge WinTV-dualHD works with the LibreELEC Tvheadend addon, but again in a desktop PC VM so power supply may not be so much of an issue.

Thanks for your investigation, it will be only a matter of time before all is revealed hopefully.

Cheers,
John
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Andrew Smith on November 07, 2022, 11:48:59 AM
Speaking of "the demise of Beyonwiz", their website looks definitively down at the moment.  Does anyone have further info on just how 'demised' they are?  Guessing they may have had terminal (no pun intended) difficulties from the manufacturing and shipping crisis of recent years.

Andrew
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 07, 2022, 04:52:52 PM
Quote from: Andrew Smith on November 07, 2022, 11:48:59 AMSpeaking of "the demise of Beyonwiz", their website looks definitively down at the moment.  Does anyone have further info on just how 'demised' they are?  Guessing they may have had terminal (no pun intended) difficulties from the manufacturing and shipping crisis of recent years.

Andrew

Andrew the site has been down since 18 October according to my post on the oztoppy forum. I am in the process of expanding the forum to include Beyonwiz users.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: NBOSTI on November 12, 2022, 11:29:02 PM
Hi IanL-S, anything further on which tuners might work with this.
I am mostly interested in whether older Elgato Diversity USB Tuners will be compatible.
They show up on my setup as GeniaTech. GeniaTech has not been supporting the Mac software, nor helpful with 64 bit support in general.
I still run 2 macs running Snow Leopard solely for the purpose of recording TV.
One is a Mac Mini via HDMI to my TV for playback of recordings if Infuse has a hitch in playing back said file. The majority of recordings are done by an iMac, still running Snow Leopard. I edit those recordings (meaning "Compact" in EyeTV terms) to get rid of unwanted pre and post content (padding), then copy them to my main  serving iMac. Infuse then handles all of the stream via my Apple TV to TV.

I know that EyeTV is contentious and a sore point with most (stemming from Genia Tech updates, also some Elgato previous) and with a lot of bugs. But sticking to the last stable release and running on SnowLeopard, 3.6.9 (7416),. A free down load if you ask. It is still the best PVR that I have used. And I will continue to use those sticks as long as they continue to work. Both that Mini and iMac are getting long in the tooth.

A bit long winded I know. But are you testing these particular tuners?
And does this IceBox software have the ability to edit recordings in a similar way? Remove sections of each recording.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 13, 2022, 08:07:37 AM
As yet the IceBox has not been released for beta testing. It is hoped they will be shipped to the beta testing team in a few days. So at this stage cannot say much.

I only have two types of USB tuners, one using 820T2 chipset (there are two versions of this and I only have the earlier version) and the other uses a Winfast chip - oddly it is reported by Windows as a dual tuner when as Beyonwiz supplied it a a single tuner. Just remebered that I have a Sony PlayTV dual USB tuner.

Cannot comment on the ability to "edit" recordings in palce; this was the only "good" feature of the Topfield TF-T6000. To an extent it depends on the API being used to create the IceBox PVR which I assume is the Kodi one.

Looks like I will be unable to test for GeniaTech as looking at eBay the cost of getting oue is prohibitive. You could try looking at the https://forum.libreelec.tv/ as there are comments on the forum about support for USB Tuners. There is an earlier post in this thread about comments on using the Sony PlayTV dual tuner.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on November 13, 2022, 10:27:41 AM
Hi NBOSTI,

The IceBox software is IceTV's adaptation of LibreELEC and TVHeadend software and they have drivers for just about everything but, at this stage, we simply don't have the time to test the Diversity or any other tuners apart from our own.  Nevertheless I'd say they "should" work just like other PC tuner cards should. Note emphasis on "should" as in "probably will".
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on November 13, 2022, 11:11:20 AM
Quote from: MD on November 13, 2022, 10:27:41 AMHi NBOSTI,

<<snip>> .... I'd say they "should" work just like other PC tuner cards should. Note emphasis on "should" as in "probably will".

Thanks MD, that was my hope/expectation. We all understand (at least I hope we do) that IceTV cannot be expected to test all the USB tuner cards that are out there.

As far as I am concerned, it is try and see if the tuner works or not.

Ian
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on November 13, 2022, 11:41:26 AM
Spot on:) 👍
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: DeltaMikeCharlie on November 13, 2022, 02:07:15 PM
Quote from: MD on November 13, 2022, 10:27:41 AMThe IceBox software is IceTV's adaptation of LibreELEC and TVHeadend software
Are you building your own Kodi PVR client add-on or a you using/modifying an existing PVR client add-on?
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: DeltaMikeCharlie on November 13, 2022, 06:58:04 PM
The ICE EPG has more data than the standard DVB EIT EPG contains.  Does IceTV plan to have the ability to add this data to the Kodi EPG display?

I'm not sure if there is any interest, but this is what I did a few years back when I wrote a TAP for Topfield PVRs:

ICE contains a repeat flag, multiple genre descriptions, production year, cast, director, language, country of origin, and the ICE series/episode tracking codes.

Because the Topfield only understands standard EIT, I had to devise a way to include the additional ICE EPG data in a way that is compatible with EIT.

I decided to mostly append the extra ICE EPG data to the EIT 'Extended Description' field, although I also tacked on the Series/Episode in decimal form plus '[R]' for repeats onto the 'Short Description' if appropriate.  I do this in a way that looks like there is a carriage return after the end of the ExtDesc and the additional ICE data just flows naturally.

I started with the categories (genres), comma separated for multiples.
On a new line, I then include a repeat indicator 'FirstRun' or 'Repeat', I then have a comma separated list of available fields such as production year, captions, language, etc, etc.
On the next new line, I have a comma separated list of the cast plus the director if one is listed.
On the final line, I present the raw ICE series and episode identifiers.  Using these fields, I can employ a keyword search to guarantee that I can narrow matches as much as possible.  These two fields are also fed to the EIT as CRIDs, although not all Topfields recognise CRIDs.

Mostly, if an ICE field was not provided for an event, it is omitted with the exception of the ICE Series/Episode codes which are intentionally shown as 'None'.

I did eventually manage to hook into the Topfield EPG display and make a more compact and colourful version, however, essentially the same presentation data is used.

I hope that this is useful.  Here are some screen shots:
01.png
02z.png
03.png
04.png 
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: prl on November 14, 2022, 12:30:52 PM
Quote from: DeltaMikeCharlie on November 13, 2022, 06:58:04 PMThe ICE EPG has more data than the standard DVB EIT EPG contains.  Does IceTV plan to have the ability to add this data to the Kodi EPG display?

Because the Topfield only understands standard EIT, I had to devise a way to include the additional ICE EPG data in a way that is compatible with EIT.

There's the same limitation in the Beyonwiz software (and in other enigma2-based software). The EPG is saved in the EIT EPG form, and it inherits all the limitations of that. It isn't helped by the strange and inconsistent mappings between the numerical and text genre names in the IceTV data.

Quote from: DeltaMikeCharlie on November 13, 2022, 06:58:04 PMI decided to mostly append the extra ICE EPG data to the EIT 'Extended Description' field

I have long intended to do something like that with the Beyonwiz code, but to make use of the fact that segments of the Extended Description could be tagged with labels, so that, say, "credits" could be stashed in an Extended Rescription section tagged with that. That would then allow the UI code to pick out and assemble various bits of the extra data in any way that it wanted.

But that would need changes to the Beyonwiz base code to make use of it, and there doesn't seem any way to do builds of the Beyonwiz firmware at the moment.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: DeltaMikeCharlie on November 14, 2022, 05:02:00 PM
Quote from: prl on November 14, 2022, 12:30:52 PMIt isn't helped by the strange and inconsistent mappings between the numerical and text genre names in the IceTV data.
Are you saying that, for example, "Science Fiction" might sometimes be translated as 0x13 and sometimes 0xA2?  Something not even close?

I'm not sure that I have encountered the issue that you describe.  I use the JSON API.  There is a 'Category' object that contains an array of categories.  Each element in that array contains both text and EIT content_descriptor.
,"category":[{"name":"Children","eit":"0x50"},{"name":"Drama","eit":"0x10"},{"name":"Dance","eit":"0x60"}],

,"category":[{"name":"Cooking","eit":"0xa5"},{"name":"Food/Wine","eit":"0xa5"}],
I append all of the text categories to the 'Extended Description' and send only 1 (first non-zero) of the EIT codes to the firmware via EIT.

The ICE documentation states that the EIT content_descriptor is 'Value as closest match to Table 28 in ETSI EN 300 468'.  Perhaps it is the 'closest match' part that is open to interpretation.

http://developer.icetv.com.au/legacy/shows.html

Also, remember that the Australian 'Freeview' content_descriptor does not comply with the ETSI standard.  It is simplified and extended.  If ICE provides a 0x14 (ETSI Movie-Comedy), FTA may provide 0x10 (AU-Movie ) or 0xC0 (AU-Comedy) for the same programme.

Quote from: prl on November 14, 2022, 12:30:52 PMI have long intended to do something like that with the Beyonwiz code, but to make use of the fact that segments of the Extended Description could be tagged with labels, so that, say, "credits" could be stashed in an Extended Rescription section tagged with that. That would then allow the UI code to pick out and assemble various bits of the extra data in any way that it wanted.
I did not even consider using 'items' in the extended description.  The Topfield firmware's EIT handling appears to be very basic and most models don't even support CRIDs.  The chances of the firmware understanding extended description tags and displaying them in a useful manner are low.  The EPG structure in RAM only refers to 'Extended Description' as a monolithic block.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: prl on November 15, 2022, 10:01:21 AM
Quote from: DeltaMikeCharlie on November 14, 2022, 05:02:00 PMThere is a 'Category' object that contains an array of categories.  Each element in that array contains both text and EIT content_descriptor.

I use the genre (content_descriptor) entries in the EIT EPG to save the genre (and do the corresponding thing with parental rating). The genre in the EIT EPG is a single byte, and so I must store the EIT content_descriptor, not the text.

There are two issues with that, the simpler one is that the content_descriptor values used by IceTV don't correspond to the ones used in the DVB standard. The other, somewhat trickier, one, is that the same content_descriptor can be used for more that one text descriptor in the IceTV EPG. That requires the content_descriptor value to be re-mapped to a different, otherwise unused, value.

Quote from: DeltaMikeCharlie on November 14, 2022, 05:02:00 PMI did not even consider using 'tags' in the extended description.  The Topfield firmware's EIT handling appears to be very basic

The Beyonwiz's EIT EPG code is also fairly basic and doesn't use tagged entries in the EIT EPG extended description (and the broadcasters don't use them either). I intended to extend the Beyonwiz API to the EPG to allow access to tagged extended description sections. But that may not be an option for Topfield.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Ian_AW on December 27, 2022, 11:03:41 AM
G'day,

I see from the latest IceTV e-mail, I see that the IceBox is now available, but there is conflicting information when I go to the web site

For me, I am extremely interested as my T2 decided to give up the ghost and make like a gift from Santa!

I would really like to know if units are being sold right now.

One other question.

I have been running a Harmony 650 remote control as the standard one suffered badly from the double click issue. Would the Harmony 650 be compatible with the IceBox?

As things stand, I am looking to get something as soon as is possible because you get so used to the benefits of a PVR.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on December 27, 2022, 12:21:53 PM
Hi, our email says that the IceBox is available from 3 January and therefore our website store will have it "live" from that day.

Regarding the Harmony our current store page for the IceBox explains that the remote is wifi so doesn't use an IR receiver. The Harmony may work if a USB IR dongle is attached but we have no code updates to support it however Logitech should have the KODI PVR software codes if you do some research for the Harmony product.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Ian_AW on December 27, 2022, 12:43:46 PM
Quote from: MD on December 27, 2022, 12:21:53 PMHi, our email says that the IceBox is available from 3 January and therefore our website store will have it "live" from that day.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Teddles on December 28, 2022, 10:38:46 AM
Quote from: MD on November 13, 2022, 10:27:41 AMThe IceBox software is IceTV's adaptation of LibreELEC and TVHeadend software

So is it fair to assume that device setup, menu structure et al will be closely akin to the Wiz V2? Will there be a standalone user guide?
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on December 28, 2022, 10:52:04 AM
Quote from: Teddles on December 28, 2022, 10:38:46 AM
Quote from: MD on November 13, 2022, 10:27:41 AMThe IceBox software is IceTV's adaptation of LibreELEC and TVHeadend software

So is it fair to assume that device setup, menu structure et al will be closely akin to the Wiz V2? Will there be a standalone user guide?


The structure is distinctly different, as is the way you navigate. Device setup (as I understand it) will be by using a wizard. For everyday use, there will be a minimalist guide on the IceTV www site. For more exotic functions, there will be a wikie maintained by the IceBox Community. There are also wiki for LibreELECT and TVheadend, and as well as their dedicated forums. The resources provided by the LibreELEC and TVheadend user communities reduces the need for a detailed user guide.

Ian

Once you get the hang of it the IceBox is very easy to use.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on December 28, 2022, 11:08:40 AM
The Setup & User guide is on our website under Help - Customer Support (don't know why no one ever looks there!!). But I'm updating it right now so the one you see is the previous version but the pictures of the "UI" and how to set padding etc are correct.  Links will be on the store, supplied to purchasers on the invoice plus a .pdf.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Teddles on December 28, 2022, 11:18:46 AM
Quote from: IanL-S on December 28, 2022, 10:52:04 AMThe structure is distinctly different, as is the way you navigate. Device setup (as I understand it) will be by using a wizard
Quote from: MD on December 28, 2022, 11:08:40 AMThe Setup & User guide is on our website under Help - Customer Support

Thx guys
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: kazz on January 09, 2023, 09:11:36 AM
Ordered an IceTV box this morning, looking forward to adding it to the system. 
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: kazz on January 16, 2023, 06:41:14 PM
Guys for those of you that have the IceTV Box (maybe beta testers) I've just plugged mine in, came up with the IceTV logo and now nothing, no response to the remote either.

Never mind rebooted the whole system have it going now.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on January 16, 2023, 07:19:12 PM
Did you get the support ticket regarding the software update before running all of the stop?
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on January 16, 2023, 07:20:15 PM
Sorry typo - all a bit front there ATM!!  Try again...

Did you get the support ticket regarding the software update before running all of the SETUP?
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: kazz on January 16, 2023, 07:54:33 PM
Quote from: MD on January 16, 2023, 07:20:15 PMSorry typo - all a bit front there ATM!!  Try again...

Did you get the support ticket regarding the software update before running all of the SETUP?

Yes thank you, mostly went fine but it gave me an ice guide error after the channel scan, haven't had a chance to look into it further yet.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on January 16, 2023, 08:31:48 PM
Hi Kazz, thanks for the feedback and apologies for repeated typos!

Can I ask that you reply via the software update support ticket so we can manage this in an organised fashion.

In the meantime the channel scan error is odd, did you wait at least a couple of minutes at the end of the SSH & SMB part of the update to allow time for the update, which happens at that point, to download, assuming you have a decent internet connection?

Can you answer all of this on the ticket please.

I'm sorry for this hassle and many thanks for being so informative.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: mingus on January 16, 2023, 11:03:52 PM
IceBox arrived today, all good so far. Quick question:
it doesn't seem to recognise my timezone. Should this be picked up from my account? I see not setting for it except specifying an ntp server? Is that required?

Thanks


Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on January 16, 2023, 11:34:54 PM
Hi, can you reply through the software update ticket I sent this morning.It helps us enormously as it links straight to your account and enables us to manage the IceBox queries in an ordered group, not lost in a list of various forum posts.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Ian_AW on January 17, 2023, 07:31:57 AM
On the time zone, I did have to set the time zone and the time server.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Ian_AW on January 17, 2023, 09:55:56 AM
Quote from: kazz on January 16, 2023, 07:54:33 PM
Quote from: MD on January 16, 2023, 07:20:15 PMSorry typo - all a bit front there ATM!!  Try again...

Did you get the support ticket regarding the software update before running all of the SETUP?

Yes thank you, mostly went fine but it gave me an ice guide error after the channel scan, haven't had a chance to look into it further yet.

The first time start up should go something like this.

Select Language.
Set Host name.
Confirm IP Address.

Now the important bit.
The next screen is the bit about SSH... DO NOT PICK NEXT FOR AT LEAST 2 MINUTES. LEAVE THIS SCREEN UP FOR AT LEAST 2 MINUTES. If you can, give it a few more minutes.

NOW after the short wait, pick Next.

This will give you the welcome to IceTV screen, and you may get some alerts about TVHeadend as it establishes a connection,

(I waited again here, just to be sure, but it is unnecessary.)

Then it is into the email and password for IceTV.

Then it is into scanning the channels and matching your IceTV account etc.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Teddles on January 20, 2023, 12:19:52 PM
Quote from: MD on January 16, 2023, 11:34:54 PMHi, can you reply through the software update ticket I sent this morning.It helps us enormously as it links straight to your account and enables us to manage the IceBox queries in an ordered group, not lost in a list of various forum posts.

Although I understand the reason for this I'm uncomfortable with the lack of transparency that this process may create.  As a prospective buyer I want to monitor how robustly the box performs from installation/setup to day-to-day operation. How issues (inevitable with a new product) are handled/resolved is important in establishing the box's 'fit for purpose' credentials. Hopefully my concerns are misplaced and readily allayed.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on January 20, 2023, 01:22:30 PM
Quote from: Teddles on January 20, 2023, 12:19:52 PM
Quote from: MD on January 16, 2023, 11:34:54 PMHi, can you reply through the software update ticket I sent this morning.It helps us enormously as it links straight to your account and enables us to manage the IceBox queries in an ordered group, not lost in a list of various forum posts.

Although I understand the reason for this I'm uncomfortable with the lack of transparency that this process may create.  As a prospective buyer I want to monitor how robustly the box performs from installation/setup to day-to-day operation. How issues (inevitable with a new product) are handled/resolved is important in establishing the box's 'fit for purpose' credentials. Hopefully my concerns are misplaced and readily allayed.

Lack of transparency is definitely not involved. Just an attempt to make the process as orderly and manageable. The development team is flat out at the moment, and they may miss something posted on the forum. I have done the same from time to time. IceBox development is only part of their role at IceTV.


Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: MD on January 20, 2023, 02:26:37 PM
If our response to your support ticket is unsatisfactory you are most welcome to post you thoughts on this forum.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: IanL-S on January 20, 2023, 03:39:13 PM
Rather than posting in this generic thread, I suggest starting a new one in one of the IceBox specific forum areas.
Title: Re: Currently available IceTV-enabled PVRs
Post by: Teddles on January 20, 2023, 04:29:47 PM
Quote from: Teddles on January 20, 2023, 12:19:52 PMHopefully my concerns are misplaced and readily allayed.

And so it came to be ... a dedicated thread is what was needed - prompt action guys ... now a happy chappy :)